Share The Wealth...

Horseballs wrote:
Meh.  I can't think of too many positions where it would be better to re-tee.  At worst, you take an unplayable and advance the ball.  Provisional is stroke + distance + having to re-hit the same shot you just knocked OB.  
The entire premise of aiming at a cart path is pretty ridiculous though.  Those things are maybe 6 feet wide and usually off to the side of the fairway.  If you miss a left cart path to the left, did you just hit it OB?  If you are so accurate that you can squarely hit a 6 foot wide ribbon from 200+ yards away, why aren't you aiming down the middle?  
There is a hole at my home course that has a pot bunker right in the middle of the fairway.  I always aim directly at it and have only hit it once.  

I played a match where the re teed ball was definitely better. Shortish par 3 downhill. I put my ball on the green. My opponent blocks his tee shot right into thick rough. He decides to hit a provisional and puts it 1 foot from the pin for a tap in 4. However we look for his first ball. After a period we are about to declare it lost when I spot it buried deep in thick grass. He declares "Great! I'll make par from here!" WRONG! It took him three hacks to get it out of the crap and he carded a triple bogie 6. To add insult to injury I three jacked for a 4 meaning he would've halved the hole if we hadn't found his first ball. LOL

Kiwigolfer wrote:

Horseballs wrote:
Meh.  I can't think of too many positions where it would be better to re-tee.  At worst, you take an unplayable and advance the ball.  Provisional is stroke + distance + having to re-hit the same shot you just knocked OB.  
The entire premise of aiming at a cart path is pretty ridiculous though.  Those things are maybe 6 feet wide and usually off to the side of the fairway.  If you miss a left cart path to the left, did you just hit it OB?  If you are so accurate that you can squarely hit a 6 foot wide ribbon from 200+ yards away, why aren't you aiming down the middle?  
There is a hole at my home course that has a pot bunker right in the middle of the fairway.  I always aim directly at it and have only hit it once.  

I played a match where the re teed ball was definitely better. Shortish par 3 downhill. I put my ball on the green. My opponent blocks his tee shot right into thick rough. He decides to hit a provisional and puts it 1 foot from the pin for a tap in 4. However we look for his first ball. After a period we are about to declare it lost when I spot it buried deep in thick grass. He declares "Great! I'll make par from here!" WRONG! It took him three hacks to get it out of the crap and he carded a triple bogie 6. To add insult to injury I three jacked for a 4 meaning he would've halved the hole if we hadn't found his first ball. LOL

The b!tch of that scenario is he could re-tee declaring the ball unplayable, but he couldn't play his provisional otherwise he would have 2 balls in play...

Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus. I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily. When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it. That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence. It was as though I'd never golfed before. I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Tough situation. It's tough to break 80 consistently unless you are playing/hitting balls with frequency. I know there are some guys who can dust off the clubs after a long break and shoot mid-70's, but it's pretty rare.
I'm guessing you've either got to lower expectations or put more time into it. Or just not play. I don't know if I could lower expectations and still find much enjoyment in the game. The times I've been in prolonged slumps (the 2009 Wishon/video experiment), golf wasn't very fun. But, unlike your situation, my situation wasn't caused by an extended break and I didn't give up the game for competing interests. If I was equally big into another hobby, I may have just dropped golf. Probably not, since I'm not a quitter, but I'm trying to be empathetic.

I've had prolonged golf layoffs over the years. Knowing what I know at my advanced age, I would not start with buckets of balls on a range but would head to a decent practice green and start with putter until I was confident enough that I was not going to three-putt very often.

Then I would practice the hell out of chipping and pitching from a variety of distances and lies until I was condident enough in my ability to chip or pitch close enough from 60 or so yards and in to take no more than three shots.

Then I would move out to the 100 yard range and practice beaucoup wedges into the green with the same goal of hitting it close enough to get in the hole with two putts.

After you've done that, your scoring shots should be a bit grooved and you could afford to blow a drive or three, an approach or four, and still be in the 80's.

Oh, and don't forget to play from the tees you can manage.

Horseballs wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Tough situation.  It's tough to break 80 consistently unless you are playing/hitting balls with frequency.  I know there are some guys who can dust off the clubs after a long break and shoot mid-70's, but it's pretty rare.  
I'm guessing you've either got to lower expectations or put more time into it.  Or just not play.  I don't know if I could lower expectations and still find much enjoyment in the game.  The times I've been in prolonged slumps (the 2009 Wishon/video experiment), golf wasn't very fun.  But, unlike your situation, my situation wasn't caused by an extended break and I didn't give up the game for competing interests.  If I was equally big into another hobby, I may have just dropped golf.  Probably not, since I'm not a quitter, but I'm trying to be empathetic.  

That's the crux of it...there's no way I'd enjoy golf being a hack...the greatest motivation would be going out with my son but he breaks 70 most of the time. We're able to fish, ski and do other things together where I'm not a nuisance. I know his tendencies so I can spend good time with him on the course without playing...as I did this summer.

I like to pursue things I can excel at. Golf just can't be one of them and I'm ok with that. When you cross 50 it's time to quit those things that aren't giving you the most benefit though well played. Quitting is an under appreciated skill. Some people would be better off if they could quit fooling themselves. My problem has been getting into the wrong things in the first place.

Mongrel wrote:I've had prolonged golf layoffs over the years. Knowing what I know at my advanced age, I would not start with buckets of balls on a range but would head to a decent practice green and start with putter until I was confident enough that I was not going to three-putt very often.

Then I would practice the hell out of chipping and pitching from a variety of distances and lies until I was condident enough in my ability to chip or pitch close enough from 60 or so yards and in to take no more than three shots.

Then I would move out to the 100 yard range and practice beaucoup wedges into the green with the same goal of hitting it close enough to get in the hole with two putts.

After you've done that, your scoring shots should be a bit grooved and you could afford to blow a drive or three, an approach or four, and still be in the 80's.

Oh, and don't forget to play from the tees you can manage.

I agree with you. Using your method it might take me approximately 15 years to get back to a 4 again considering the time I'd have for golf. Thanks for helping me make the decision to not get back into it.

Lorenzzo wrote:

Horseballs wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Tough situation.  It's tough to break 80 consistently unless you are playing/hitting balls with frequency.  I know there are some guys who can dust off the clubs after a long break and shoot mid-70's, but it's pretty rare.  
I'm guessing you've either got to lower expectations or put more time into it.  Or just not play.  I don't know if I could lower expectations and still find much enjoyment in the game.  The times I've been in prolonged slumps (the 2009 Wishon/video experiment), golf wasn't very fun.  But, unlike your situation, my situation wasn't caused by an extended break and I didn't give up the game for competing interests.  If I was equally big into another hobby, I may have just dropped golf.  Probably not, since I'm not a quitter, but I'm trying to be empathetic.  

That's the crux of it...there's no way I'd enjoy golf being a hack...the greatest motivation would be going out with my son but he breaks 70 most of the time.  We're able to fish, ski and do other things together where I'm not a nuisance.   I know his tendencies so I can spend good time with him on the course without playing...as I did this summer.

I like to pursue things I can excel at.  Golf just can't be one of them and I'm ok with that.  When you cross 50 it's time to quit those things that aren't giving you the most benefit though well played.  Quitting is an under appreciated skill.  Some people would be better off if they could quit fooling themselves.  My problem has been getting into the wrong things in the first place.

It's also in my personality to want to do everything I do well. It's almost a curse. I can't just go and run a charity 5K, I've got to run it fast, even if I haven't been running. It's pretty much everything.

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself. Or just find a different reason to golf. I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours. Nothing more than a 40 yard shot. But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green. Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years. I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations. I play with many players that had game in college or high school. It took them many years to forget that they once were good. It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer. I quit for a number of years. My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again. Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself.  Or just find a different reason to golf.  I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours.  Nothing more than a 40 yard shot.  But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green.  Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years.  I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations.  I play with many players that had game in college or high school.  It took them many years to forget that they once were good.  It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer.  I quit for a number of years.  My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again.  Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.  

The other day I was on my road bike going up Holiday Loop. My plan was to just get the heart rate to 130 or so when fully warm and kind of cruise. I had plans for a long mountain bike ride with friends the next day and didn't want to burn off what I'd have for that. Then all of a sudden this douche passes me on a $10,000 Cervelo and heads up the road. He was wearing a gaudy jersey that made him look like he was in a major race. He had $400 shoes. He smiled as he passed.

My bike outweighed his by about three pounds but so does my competitive spirit. I kicked it into sprint and raced him. It was awesome. We came down the rail trail, went up past the white barn and then towards Thayne's canyon. I thought to myself, this little shit is probably 140, I'm 190 and you don't see guys my size winning races. Didn't matter I pushed past the pain, past the thoughts about tomorrow and after 35 minutes of that lost him back on Route 224 near the entrance to The Canyons.

The next day was sheer fucking torture. Fortunately MB is more about survival and touring than racing...and we were with chicks. Not the feminine type but still chicks.

The point is I'm like HB. I don't need to win all the time but I want at least a shot at it. I know there are some who love the feel of a well struck shot, the cadence of a social round, the crisp of the air in the fall, the camaraderie, the sharing, the process of improving. Well fuck those guys I want to do it well and i want to win. I wasn't only bored when I quit but I was usually playing with guys who were just way better than me and I was a 4.

There are sports where the guy who's better than me is a rare duck. Given the choice I prefer those. I am the way I am and make no apologies. Would I rather be the guy I describe above who can hack and smile? Sure, I'd enjoy everything more I guess. But I'm just not that guy....

Mongrel wrote:I've had prolonged golf layoffs over the years. Knowing what I know at my advanced age, I would not start with buckets of balls on a range but would head to a decent practice green and start with putter until I was confident enough that I was not going to three-putt very often.

Then I would practice the hell out of chipping and pitching from a variety of distances and lies until I was condident enough in my ability to chip or pitch close enough from 60 or so yards and in to take no more than three shots.

Then I would move out to the 100 yard range and practice beaucoup wedges into the green with the same goal of hitting it close enough to get in the hole with two putts.

After you've done that, your scoring shots should be a bit grooved and you could afford to blow a drive or three, an approach or four, and still be in the 80's.

Oh, and don't forget to play from the tees you can manage.

Terrible advice! The first thing you should do after a long layoff is dust off the driver, get a LARGE bucket of balls and go hit bombs. Once you have hit enough bombs with driver to get the testosterone flowing if there are any balls left over maybe hit a few 6 irons. If not happy get another LARGE bucket and repeat.

Now head to the 1st tee and burn it up.

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself.  Or just find a different reason to golf.  I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours.  Nothing more than a 40 yard shot.  But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green.  Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years.  I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations.  I play with many players that had game in college or high school.  It took them many years to forget that they once were good.  It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer.  I quit for a number of years.  My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again.  Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.  

The other day I was on my road bike going up Holiday Loop.  My plan was to just get the heart rate to 130 or so when fully warm and kind of cruise.  I had plans for a long mountain bike ride with friends the next day and didn't want to burn off what I'd have for that.  Then all of a sudden this douche passes me on a $10,000 Cervelo and heads up the road.  He was wearing a gaudy jersey that made him look like he was in a major race.  He had $400 shoes.  He smiled as he passed.

My bike outweighed his by about three pounds but so does my competitive spirit.  I kicked it into sprint and raced him.  It was awesome.  We came down the rail trail, went up past the white barn and then towards Thayne's canyon. I thought to myself, this little shit is probably 140, I'm 190 and you don't see guys my size winning races.  Didn't matter I pushed past the pain, past the thoughts about tomorrow and after 35 minutes of that lost him back on Route 224 near the entrance to The Canyons.

The next day was sheer fucking torture. Fortunately MB is more about survival and touring than racing...and we were with chicks.  Not the feminine type but still chicks.

The point is I'm like HB.  I don't need to win all the time but I want at least a shot at it.  I know there are some who love the feel of a well struck shot, the cadence of a social round, the crisp of the air in the fall, the camaraderie, the sharing, the process of improving.  Well fuck those guys I want to do it well and i want to win.  I wasn't only bored when I quit but I was usually playing with guys who were just way better than me and I was a 4.

There are sports where the guy who's better than me is a rare duck.  Given the choice I prefer those.  I am the way I am and make no apologies.  Would I rather be the guy I describe above who can hack and smile?  Sure, I'd enjoy everything more I guess.  But I'm just not that guy....

Nice for now. I guess you better start looking at old man sports. Maybe car racing or sailing because your days of "winning" against the open field are numbered. Sad truth, but the truth. I'm younger than you and I enjoy competition, but I also can enjoy a walk in the park hitting golf balls. Better than grinding out a 4 hour hack fest and post a 75. I've played with many of that type and it bored the hell out of me.

Kiwigolfer wrote:

Mongrel wrote:I've had prolonged golf layoffs over the years. Knowing what I know at my advanced age, I would not start with buckets of balls on a range but would head to a decent practice green and start with putter until I was confident enough that I was not going to three-putt very often.

Then I would practice the hell out of chipping and pitching from a variety of distances and lies until I was condident enough in my ability to chip or pitch close enough from 60 or so yards and in to take no more than three shots.

Then I would move out to the 100 yard range and practice beaucoup wedges into the green with the same goal of hitting it close enough to get in the hole with two putts.

After you've done that, your scoring shots should be a bit grooved and you could afford to blow a drive or three, an approach or four, and still be in the 80's.

Oh, and don't forget to play from the tees you can manage.

Terrible advice! The first thing you should do after a long layoff is dust off the driver, get a LARGE bucket of balls and go hit bombs. Once you have hit enough bombs with driver to get the testosterone flowing if there are any balls left over maybe hit a few 6 irons. If not happy get another LARGE bucket and repeat.

Now head to the 1st tee and burn it up.

6 iron? Might as well have said 25 degree hybrid.
Crushed drivers, then some floppers. Honestly, if you crush driver far enough, those are the only 2 shots required.

Horseballs wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:

Mongrel wrote:I've had prolonged golf layoffs over the years. Knowing what I know at my advanced age, I would not start with buckets of balls on a range but would head to a decent practice green and start with putter until I was confident enough that I was not going to three-putt very often.

Then I would practice the hell out of chipping and pitching from a variety of distances and lies until I was condident enough in my ability to chip or pitch close enough from 60 or so yards and in to take no more than three shots.

Then I would move out to the 100 yard range and practice beaucoup wedges into the green with the same goal of hitting it close enough to get in the hole with two putts.

After you've done that, your scoring shots should be a bit grooved and you could afford to blow a drive or three, an approach or four, and still be in the 80's.

Oh, and don't forget to play from the tees you can manage.

Terrible advice! The first thing you should do after a long layoff is dust off the driver, get a LARGE bucket of balls and go hit bombs. Once you have hit enough bombs with driver to get the testosterone flowing if there are any balls left over maybe hit a few 6 irons. If not happy get another LARGE bucket and repeat.

Now head to the 1st tee and burn it up.

6 iron?  Might as well have said 25 degree hybrid.  
Crushed drivers, then some floppers.  Honestly, if you crush driver far enough, those are the only 2 shots required.

The 6 iron is for the par 5's going for the green in two. Floppers are like chipping and putting. No need to practice them just go play.

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself.  Or just find a different reason to golf.  I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours.  Nothing more than a 40 yard shot.  But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green.  Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years.  I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations.  I play with many players that had game in college or high school.  It took them many years to forget that they once were good.  It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer.  I quit for a number of years.  My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again.  Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.  

The other day I was on my road bike going up Holiday Loop.  My plan was to just get the heart rate to 130 or so when fully warm and kind of cruise.  I had plans for a long mountain bike ride with friends the next day and didn't want to burn off what I'd have for that.  Then all of a sudden this douche passes me on a $10,000 Cervelo and heads up the road.  He was wearing a gaudy jersey that made him look like he was in a major race.  He had $400 shoes.  He smiled as he passed.

My bike outweighed his by about three pounds but so does my competitive spirit.  I kicked it into sprint and raced him.  It was awesome.  We came down the rail trail, went up past the white barn and then towards Thayne's canyon. I thought to myself, this little shit is probably 140, I'm 190 and you don't see guys my size winning races.  Didn't matter I pushed past the pain, past the thoughts about tomorrow and after 35 minutes of that lost him back on Route 224 near the entrance to The Canyons.

The next day was sheer fucking torture. Fortunately MB is more about survival and touring than racing...and we were with chicks.  Not the feminine type but still chicks.

The point is I'm like HB.  I don't need to win all the time but I want at least a shot at it.  I know there are some who love the feel of a well struck shot, the cadence of a social round, the crisp of the air in the fall, the camaraderie, the sharing, the process of improving.  Well fuck those guys I want to do it well and i want to win.  I wasn't only bored when I quit but I was usually playing with guys who were just way better than me and I was a 4.

There are sports where the guy who's better than me is a rare duck.  Given the choice I prefer those.  I am the way I am and make no apologies.  Would I rather be the guy I describe above who can hack and smile?  Sure, I'd enjoy everything more I guess.  But I'm just not that guy....

Nice for now.  I guess you better start looking at old man sports.  Maybe car racing or sailing because your days of "winning" against the open field are numbered.  Sad truth, but the truth.  I'm younger than you and I enjoy competition, but I also can enjoy a walk in the park hitting golf balls.  Better than grinding out a 4 hour hack fest and post a 75.  I've played with many of that type and it bored the hell out of me.  

Well aware which is why I'm looking to enjoy as much competition as I can while I can. There are well conditioned folks here who do well into their early 60s. However long I get when it's done it's done. It may be an injury away. Don't know what I'll do really when I'm too old to fuck or compete.  

Everything has a beginning and an end. I'll try and make my days at the end as worthwhile as the ones at the beginning.

Competitive cooking maybe.

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself.  Or just find a different reason to golf.  I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours.  Nothing more than a 40 yard shot.  But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green.  Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years.  I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations.  I play with many players that had game in college or high school.  It took them many years to forget that they once were good.  It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer.  I quit for a number of years.  My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again.  Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.  

The other day I was on my road bike going up Holiday Loop.  My plan was to just get the heart rate to 130 or so when fully warm and kind of cruise.  I had plans for a long mountain bike ride with friends the next day and didn't want to burn off what I'd have for that.  Then all of a sudden this douche passes me on a $10,000 Cervelo and heads up the road.  He was wearing a gaudy jersey that made him look like he was in a major race.  He had $400 shoes.  He smiled as he passed.

My bike outweighed his by about three pounds but so does my competitive spirit.  I kicked it into sprint and raced him.  It was awesome.  We came down the rail trail, went up past the white barn and then towards Thayne's canyon. I thought to myself, this little shit is probably 140, I'm 190 and you don't see guys my size winning races.  Didn't matter I pushed past the pain, past the thoughts about tomorrow and after 35 minutes of that lost him back on Route 224 near the entrance to The Canyons.

The next day was sheer fucking torture. Fortunately MB is more about survival and touring than racing...and we were with chicks.  Not the feminine type but still chicks.

The point is I'm like HB.  I don't need to win all the time but I want at least a shot at it.  I know there are some who love the feel of a well struck shot, the cadence of a social round, the crisp of the air in the fall, the camaraderie, the sharing, the process of improving.  Well fuck those guys I want to do it well and i want to win.  I wasn't only bored when I quit but I was usually playing with guys who were just way better than me and I was a 4.

There are sports where the guy who's better than me is a rare duck.  Given the choice I prefer those.  I am the way I am and make no apologies.  Would I rather be the guy I describe above who can hack and smile?  Sure, I'd enjoy everything more I guess.  But I'm just not that guy....

Nice for now.  I guess you better start looking at old man sports.  Maybe car racing or sailing because your days of "winning" against the open field are numbered.  Sad truth, but the truth.  I'm younger than you and I enjoy competition, but I also can enjoy a walk in the park hitting golf balls.  Better than grinding out a 4 hour hack fest and post a 75.  I've played with many of that type and it bored the hell out of me.  

Well aware which is why I'm looking to enjoy as much competition as I can while I can. There are well conditioned folks here who do well into their early 60s. However long I get when it's done it's done. It may be an injury away. Don't know what I'll do really when I'm too old to fuck or compete.  

Everything has a beginning and an end. I'll try and make my days at the end as worthwhile as the ones at the beginning.

Competitive cooking maybe.

So age group competition wouldn't cut it for you Zo?

Seems a natural progression for athletic pursuits like cycling.

Kiwigolfer wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Lorenzzo wrote:

trombettista_vecchio wrote:Lorenzo, you also have some back to the game?

I'd like to but I don't know if I'll have the time or focus.  I cycle a lot both road and mountain in the warm season here and am in the gym almost daily.  When I gave up golf three years ago I'd gotten kind of bored with it.

Now I miss it.  That said, after having a miserable time hitting my first bucket after the layoff, I'm kind of on the fence.  It was as though I'd never golfed before.  I don't think I'd enjoy golf unless I have at least a good shot at breaking 80 when I play and for me that would require a lot more time than I think I'll have.

How long did you lay off?

Fuck it Zo! Just go pitch and putt a few times a week for couple of weeks. Then hit the range with short irons up to a seven iron. Play a few executive courses and see. If the bug bites, continue. If it doesn't, don't frustrate yourself.  Or just find a different reason to golf.  I always love a round of golf in the desert when the sun is just rising, or 9 holes at sunset.

Personally, I could chip and putt for hours.  Nothing more than a 40 yard shot.  But then I grew up getting babysat by my old man at the putting green.  Even if I gave up golf, I'd probably keep a wedge and a putter just to dink around a practice green a couple of times a month.

I took a layoff from the game, but it was for almost 20 years.  I had no expectations or memories of how good or bad I was back when I played. So, it was like starting fresh without expectations.  I play with many players that had game in college or high school.  It took them many years to forget that they once were good.  It was terrible to watch them struggle, have fits, throw clubs, etc. while only posting a 78. Now that it's been some years, they have kids, a career, etc. they just enjoy getting out and hitting some good shots. I had the same issue with soccer.  I quit for a number of years.  My brain thought I could do what I once did with ease. It was very frustrating. I've thought about picking it up again.  Maybe winter indoor soccer. Now that I'm older I won't be playing against 20 year olds that think they can still turn pro.  

The other day I was on my road bike going up Holiday Loop.  My plan was to just get the heart rate to 130 or so when fully warm and kind of cruise.  I had plans for a long mountain bike ride with friends the next day and didn't want to burn off what I'd have for that.  Then all of a sudden this douche passes me on a $10,000 Cervelo and heads up the road.  He was wearing a gaudy jersey that made him look like he was in a major race.  He had $400 shoes.  He smiled as he passed.

My bike outweighed his by about three pounds but so does my competitive spirit.  I kicked it into sprint and raced him.  It was awesome.  We came down the rail trail, went up past the white barn and then towards Thayne's canyon. I thought to myself, this little shit is probably 140, I'm 190 and you don't see guys my size winning races.  Didn't matter I pushed past the pain, past the thoughts about tomorrow and after 35 minutes of that lost him back on Route 224 near the entrance to The Canyons.

The next day was sheer fucking torture. Fortunately MB is more about survival and touring than racing...and we were with chicks.  Not the feminine type but still chicks.

The point is I'm like HB.  I don't need to win all the time but I want at least a shot at it.  I know there are some who love the feel of a well struck shot, the cadence of a social round, the crisp of the air in the fall, the camaraderie, the sharing, the process of improving.  Well fuck those guys I want to do it well and i want to win.  I wasn't only bored when I quit but I was usually playing with guys who were just way better than me and I was a 4.

There are sports where the guy who's better than me is a rare duck.  Given the choice I prefer those.  I am the way I am and make no apologies.  Would I rather be the guy I describe above who can hack and smile?  Sure, I'd enjoy everything more I guess.  But I'm just not that guy....

Nice for now.  I guess you better start looking at old man sports.  Maybe car racing or sailing because your days of "winning" against the open field are numbered.  Sad truth, but the truth.  I'm younger than you and I enjoy competition, but I also can enjoy a walk in the park hitting golf balls.  Better than grinding out a 4 hour hack fest and post a 75.  I've played with many of that type and it bored the hell out of me.  

Well aware which is why I'm looking to enjoy as much competition as I can while I can. There are well conditioned folks here who do well into their early 60s. However long I get when it's done it's done. It may be an injury away. Don't know what I'll do really when I'm too old to fuck or compete.  

Everything has a beginning and an end. I'll try and make my days at the end as worthwhile as the ones at the beginning.

Competitive cooking maybe.

So age group competition wouldn't cut it for you Zo?

Seems a natural progression for athletic pursuits like cycling.

Yes it does in fact I'm already doing that in both skiing and cycling. There are great masters programs here. I have no chance against young guys in either sport in formal competition. But Masters isn't really that far behind.

In casual cycling and skiing I can almost always hold my own against the young guys. I seem to find as much competition in supposed casual situations as in organized racing. My plan is to crush more young inflated egos this winter on the hill.

Unfortunately, however, if you look at the numbers my competitive effectiveness in Masters racing will decline somewhat rapidly from the mid 50s on.  

This is my last hurrah and it's of unknown length.

Well Zo, to quote Clint Eastwood, a good man know his limitations and it sounds like you have found yours.

Just a warning Zo. You don't want to be the old guy on the hill or bike who is the only one competing. You'd be like the dude in pick up basketball who is trying way too hard on defense and throwing elbows under the rim because he can't compete in a regular way. Or the guy at the bar who is 10 years too old trying to act and dress age-inappropriate. You know it when you see it, but would you know it if it was you? I would liken it to little man's disease. Nothing is more pathetic.

I don't know if I've ever been on a hill with good skiers where there wasn't at least some form of subtle competition going on. Same on road bikes.  They're racing sports after all. Until you fall back you aren't too old to compete in those things.

I agree though on the bar scene stuff. No tats, ponytails or current music references for me. That said there is a whole lot of age separation you see that collects together. A lot of the old guys have Willie Nelson type cool.

I get it though having spent a little time in Kansas City. People really don't age well in the Midwest. Trying to hang in there seems pathetic. The West is different.

Lorenzzo wrote:I don't know if I've ever been on a hill with good skiers where there wasn't at least some form of subtle competition going on. Same on road bikes.  They're racing sports after all. Until you fall back you aren't too old to compete in those things.

I agree though on the bar scene stuff. No tats, ponytails or current music references for me. That said there is a whole lot of age separation you see that collects together. A lot of the old guys have Willie Nelson type cool.

I get it though having spent a little time in Kansas City. People really don't age well in the Midwest. Trying to hang in there seems pathetic. The West is different.

How can you be individually competitive in road biking? We always biked in a group, alternating who is pushing the wind. You can't just move up to the front and blow everyone away. That would be the ultimate dick move. From what I can tell, that is how everyone everywhere does it. I guess you could mean in an actual race, but of course that's going to be competitive. Now there is a definite competitiveness to which group you ride in, but never within the group.

Well of course in a large group that's true, where often the riders like or need the security of each other.

Most riding here however is done individually, with several other riders or in weekend quasi race excursions. The pace most definitely gets pushed. The most fun is individual when you come up on another rider or he comes up on you. It's kind of like dragracing as a teenager.

I will say this place is not like others I've been. It is really really competitive here.

Zo,,, I hate to say it... but don't be a cunttttttt , Hit a bucket with your 8i... then 25* gaybrid, 22* gaybrid, then 19* gaybrid... stop where you have problem. Hit with the club you feel comfortable with and get back into the game. I shot the worse game in yrs on Monday 102.... even shank my chip, how could you shank a chip shot? I will show you how, that's how I got into green side bunkers ... and I forgot how to get out, took at least 3 swings to get out... and I got in green side bunkers 3 times. do the math

Lorenzzo wrote:Well of course in a large group that's true, where often the riders like or need the security of each other.

Most riding here however is done individually, with several other riders or in weekend quasi race excursions. The pace most definitely gets pushed. The most fun is individual when you come up on another rider or he comes up on you. It's kind of like dragracing as a teenager.

I will say this place is not like others I've been. It is really really competitive here.

Do you really ride solo most of the time? I was into cycling pretty avidly at one point, and we exclusively rode in groups of 2 - 5. This was in the hill country of Texas where a certain blood doper you may have heard of did most of his training. Maybe it's different where you are, but there were way too many clueless drivers to ride solo. Even the USAF triathlon team would cycle in groups. I never lived and breathed it, but most of the solo work was done on spinning bikes indoors, and usually in intervals of sprints and recovery.
Within the group, I'd try to push the pace when out front.