Share The Wealth...

If I made as much money as he does playing a game I love, I would spread out some Franklins, too. He never knows when Amy is going to dirt nap so having some perky waitresses anticipating his visits, well, it never hurts. Like the Boy Scouts say, "Be prepared."

I've long been a proponent of very large tips in certain situations. My minimum at a coffee shop when there is a sweet waitress who busts her butt with a smile is 40 bucks. They make dirt.

On the other hand I'm a terrible tipper if someone has an entitled attitude but little skill or effort. I had an awful caddy at Bandon Dunes several years back. He got into disagreements with his player, the player overruled him and made the right calls but the Caddy continued to be a disruption.

I gave him the minimum recommended tip. He came back and advised me he was a Master Caddy and tips were typically more. I said oh my mistake, please give me back the envelope and I will make an adjustment. He did and I pulled out three of the 20s. I handed it back to him and said you're right I made an error and have adjusted it to a more appropriate amount.

He complained again and I said you know what, I'll go in and let the head caddy give me his opinion. I did and the head caddy apologized, said the Caddy was lucky to get anything and would be subject to discipline.

I grew up playing with caddies at my father's club. Most of the members were Italian. The head pro was Italian. The caddy master and all the caddies were Italian. There was one caddy who was very slow. Retarded but not a Mongoloid. In the old days such people were termed "feeble-minded". Instead of sticking him in some institution, he was a full time caddy. A slightly built short guy, he would carry double and hustle his butt off to rake the traps, tend the flag and all the attendant caddy stuff. He knew how many yards to the green centers from each shrub and tree. The members always tipped him well and, in his feeble mind, I'm sure his self esteem was boosted by being able to help support mamma and papa.

On the other hand, carts never complain about lack of tips or how heavy the bag is. Plus they can hold all sorts of accessories and go up and down hills without complaint. Now they won't club you, tend your flag or rake bunkers but you can do all that yourself. I know that I will never play a track like Bandon Dunes that prohibits carts and requires caddies be employed.

I do not, however, belittle the role a caddy can play. Besides the golf stuff, a good caddy can be a reliable source of righteous pot and quality p#ssy.

Mongrel wrote:I grew up playing with caddies at my father's club. Most of the members were Italian. The head pro was Italian. The caddy master and all the caddies were Italian. There was one caddy who was very slow. Retarded but not a Mongoloid. In the old days such people were termed "feeble-minded". Instead of sticking him in some institution, he was a full time caddy. A slightly built short guy, he would carry double and hustle his butt off to rake the traps, tend the flag and all the attendant caddy stuff. He knew how many yards to the green centers from each shrub and tree. The members always tipped him well and, in his feeble mind, I'm sure his self esteem was boosted by being able to help support mamma and papa.

On the other hand, carts never complain about lack of tips or how heavy the bag is. Plus they can hold all sorts of accessories and go up and down hills without complaint. Now they won't club you, tend your flag or rake bunkers but you can do all that yourself. I know that I will never play a track like Bandon Dunes that prohibits carts and requires caddies be employed.

I do not, however, belittle the role a caddy can play. Besides the golf stuff, a good caddy can be a reliable source of righteous pot and quality p#ssy.

In response to the bolded, a good playing partner can also provide quality extracurricular entertainment of the gentlemanly variety. The golf course is a great place to do business.  

Our caddies are glorified luggage handlers. Neighborhood kids, from a not so great neighborhood. I typically like the kids, but they are fairly shy, not really knowing what is appropriate banter. I had one quit on me after 9 a few weeks ago. She was slow, chubby and clueless. The kind of person you need to coach, which is typically fine, but I don't like to have to tell them multiple times, and at the very least they should keep up.
She did manage to drink 2 gatorades and eat a Snickers bar in 9 holes. She wasn't acting sick or complaining. On the 9th green, she asked if she could go home. I asked her if she was feeling OK, and she said yes. I told her to say goodbye to her friends, because I blasted the caddy master and she no longer caddies at the SPCC. It was so strange, because I was playing a matchplay game that was pretty tight after 9. I had another honor caddy in the group double bag, which is typically not done at my course. I tipped that dude pretty well.

Horseballs wrote:Our caddies are glorified luggage handlers.  Neighborhood kids, from a not so great neighborhood.  I typically like the kids, but they are fairly shy, not really knowing what is appropriate banter.  I had one quit on me after 9 a few weeks ago.  She was slow, chubby and clueless.  The kind of person you need to coach, which is typically fine, but I don't like to have to tell them multiple times, and at the very least they should keep up.  
She did manage to drink 2 gatorades and eat a Snickers bar in 9 holes.  She wasn't acting sick or complaining.  On the 9th green, she asked if she could go home.  I asked her if she was feeling OK, and she said yes.  I told her to say goodbye to her friends, because I blasted the caddy master and she no longer caddies at the SPCC.  It was so strange, because I was playing a matchplay game that was pretty tight after 9.  I had another honor caddy in the group double bag, which is typically not done at my course.  I tipped that dude pretty well.  

This is almost vintage GR HB. The sort of post that would maybe get you banned on golfwrx, otherwise known as weaksauce trolling on GR.

If you'd said you slapped the kid around, before calling her parents directly and reprimanding them for raising such a slacker, you'd have been closer to form.

You're precariously close to tarnishing your legacy. If you keep going down this path you'll end up being a jobber to the stars (JTTS for short) in no time.

You'll be the Bengals.  

Mongrel wrote:I grew up playing with caddies at my father's club. Most of the members were Italian. The head pro was Italian. The caddy master and all the caddies were Italian. There was one caddy who was very slow. Retarded but not a Mongoloid. In the old days such people were termed "feeble-minded". Instead of sticking him in some institution, he was a full time caddy. A slightly built short guy, he would carry double and hustle his butt off to rake the traps, tend the flag and all the attendant caddy stuff. He knew how many yards to the green centers from each shrub and tree. The members always tipped him well and, in his feeble mind, I'm sure his self esteem was boosted by being able to help support mamma and papa.

On the other hand, carts never complain about lack of tips or how heavy the bag is. Plus they can hold all sorts of accessories and go up and down hills without complaint. Now they won't club you, tend your flag or rake bunkers but you can do all that yourself. I know that I will never play a track like Bandon Dunes that prohibits carts and requires caddies be employed.

I do not, however, belittle the role a caddy can play. Besides the golf stuff, a good caddy can be a reliable source of righteous pot and quality p#ssy.

Bandon doesn't prohibit carts. If you have a handicap they'll give you a cart. You can walk or use a push cart. You can get fore caddy for the group, split a caddy with one other player, or have your own caddy. The best part is there are not any cart paths. Just grass, tall grass and gorse.

FreakOfNature wrote:

Horseballs wrote:Our caddies are glorified luggage handlers.  Neighborhood kids, from a not so great neighborhood.  I typically like the kids, but they are fairly shy, not really knowing what is appropriate banter.  I had one quit on me after 9 a few weeks ago.  She was slow, chubby and clueless.  The kind of person you need to coach, which is typically fine, but I don't like to have to tell them multiple times, and at the very least they should keep up.  
She did manage to drink 2 gatorades and eat a Snickers bar in 9 holes.  She wasn't acting sick or complaining.  On the 9th green, she asked if she could go home.  I asked her if she was feeling OK, and she said yes.  I told her to say goodbye to her friends, because I blasted the caddy master and she no longer caddies at the SPCC.  It was so strange, because I was playing a matchplay game that was pretty tight after 9.  I had another honor caddy in the group double bag, which is typically not done at my course.  I tipped that dude pretty well.  

This is almost vintage GR HB. The sort of post that would maybe get you banned on golfwrx, otherwise known as weaksauce trolling on GR.

If you'd said you slapped the kid around, before calling her parents directly and reprimanding them for raising such a slacker, you'd have been closer to form.

You're precariously close to tarnishing your legacy. If you keep going down this path you'll end up being a jobber to the stars (JTTS for short) in no time.

You'll be the Bengals.  

My legacy is forged in titanium. That story actually happened as written. I can certainly embellish it to meet with strict GR guidelines. I've made my stance quite well known when it comes to caddies (Stevie excepted). Burnout luggage carriers.

Bandon doesn't prohibit carts.  If you have a handicap they'll give you a cart.  You can walk or use a push cart.  You can get fore caddy for the group,  split a caddy with one other player,  or  have your own caddy.  The best part is there are not any cart paths.  Just grass, tall grass and gorse.[/quote]


All the courses I play have cart paths. On some of the longer holes, mostly par 5's, I will sometimes aim my drive to hit a cartpath if the consequences of missing it are nil and the benefit is huge--like 30-80 yards.

Bandon is by far the greatest golf experience on this continent.

Mongrel wrote:Bandon doesn't prohibit carts.  If you have a handicap they'll give you a cart.  You can walk or use a push cart.  You can get fore caddy for the group,  split a caddy with one other player,  or  have your own caddy.  The best part is there are not any cart paths.  Just grass, tall grass and gorse.

All the courses I play have cart paths. On some of the longer holes, mostly par 5's, I will sometimes aim my drive to hit a cartpath if the consequences of missing it are nil and the benefit is huge--like 30-80 yards.[/quote]

Great, but what I absolutely hate is the missed green that hits a cart path and sends the ball 30 yards past the green. They are also the ugliest part of a modern golf course. Bandon is incredible for many reasons, but I love that fact that there isn't a asphalt road running through the course.

Maybe if I was an old short knocker like you I'd see them more as an advantage than a annoyance. Not to mention most golf cart riders are lazy. I see them all the time, two in a cart driving in circles in the trees, in the rough looking for a ball. WTF? Get the hell out of the cart and use both sets of eyes to look for the ball. Not to mention they are matting down the rough. We have a PGA and a Web.com event here in Portland every year. The best part about playing these courses near the event date is they don't allow carts off the paths. The rough is dense and standing straight up. Carts ruin a course. Or should I say, the idiots driving carts ruin a course. Carts belong in two places on a golf course - 1) on the path; 2) on the Fairway. No where else. Maybe in a pond.

Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Zing!!!!!!

And if I was playing a match against Poe, there's no chance I look for his ball.

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Posting of a short knocker. Miss a green by 20 yards going for the green in two from 250 out shouldn't result in a lost ball. Especially when missing the green by 18 or 22 yards is an easy up and down for a birdie.

Having to rely on a cart path to give extra distance means you should consider moving to the forward tees. Unless a cart path crosses a fairway, no reasonable person would aim for said cart path. The only exception I can think of is if you are playing in a scramble format and someone is in good position already. Or your you play a goat track that has no rough, water or hay. Then the benefit might out way the penalty of missing the cart path.

Horseballs wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Zing!!!!!!

And if I was playing a match against Poe, there's no chance I look for his ball.  

I'd look for yours if I knew finding it would be worse off then playing another at your last shot.

I almost posted this in your other thread. If someone is in a worse position finding the original ball, and they are a DB, I'll spend some time helping them find it. A smart golfer will realize they can deem it unplayable and re-hit from the tee, but most wont because it requires the walk of shame. Even if they hit a provisional, they have to go back and re-tee.

Poe4soul wrote:

Horseballs wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Zing!!!!!!

And if I was playing a match against Poe, there's no chance I look for his ball.  

I'd look for yours if I knew finding it would be worse off then playing another at your last shot.  

I almost posted this in your other thread.  If someone is in a worse position finding the original ball, and they are a DB, I'll spend some time helping them find it.  A smart golfer will realize they can deem it unplayable  and re-hit from the tee, but most wont because it requires the walk of shame.  Even if they hit a provisional, they have to go back and re-tee.

Meh. I can't think of too many positions where it would be better to re-tee. At worst, you take an unplayable and advance the ball. Provisional is stroke + distance + having to re-hit the same shot you just knocked OB.
The entire premise of aiming at a cart path is pretty ridiculous though. Those things are maybe 6 feet wide and usually off to the side of the fairway. If you miss a left cart path to the left, did you just hit it OB? If you are so accurate that you can squarely hit a 6 foot wide ribbon from 200+ yards away, why aren't you aiming down the middle?
There is a hole at my home course that has a pot bunker right in the middle of the fairway. I always aim directly at it and have only hit it once.

It should be pretty obvious why one might aim a drive at a section of cart path. Same reason you might aim at a knoll just off the fairway. They are usually high spots and when a drive hits on or near one, the first kick off the surface can be substantial. Plus cartpaths are typically placed on the higher side of the fairway. Meaning if you are in an area with lots of moisture or there has been recent rain or the morons who run the course overload the fairways with water, the high side will give you more roll. This is just simple common sense local knowledge. If you have never explored precise placement shots with driver but always tee it up in the center of the tee box and aim down the center of the fairway, then you might not comprehend. If you play the course strategically like a game of nine ball or straight, you will be considering all the angles with every shot you make. Us short knockers have to use all the tools available to compete.

Mongrel wrote:It should be pretty obvious why one might aim a drive at a section of cart path. Same reason you might aim at a knoll just off the fairway. They are usually high spots and when a drive hits on or near one, the first kick off the surface can be substantial. Plus cartpaths are typically placed on the higher side of the fairway. Meaning if you are in an area with lots of moisture or there has been recent rain or the morons who run the course overload the fairways with water, the high side will give you more roll. This is just simple common sense local knowledge. If you have never explored precise placement shots with driver but always tee it up in the center of the tee box and aim down the center of the fairway, then you might not comprehend. If you play the course strategically like a game of nine ball or straight, you will be considering all the angles with every shot you make. Us short knockers have to use all the tools available to compete.

Oh, I get what your saying. It's very relative to the distance you hit the ball. If you hit the ball 230 and you get a kick from the cart path your 260. If you carry the ball 260+, more than likely the extra distance you get from hitting the cart path will be less favorable than hitting the fairway. Plus, hitting a 6 foot wide cart path 260 yards out isn't worth even trying. It's all a matter of perspective, and geometry. From my experience, hitting a golf cart is usually less favorable than not. The few times it works out rarely results in a loss of a stroke on the card and the times you do have a better chance of adding a stroke or more. Cart paths suck on a golf course.

Horseballs wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Horseballs wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Zing!!!!!!

And if I was playing a match against Poe, there's no chance I look for his ball.  

I'd look for yours if I knew finding it would be worse off then playing another at your last shot.  

I almost posted this in your other thread.  If someone is in a worse position finding the original ball, and they are a DB, I'll spend some time helping them find it.  A smart golfer will realize they can deem it unplayable  and re-hit from the tee, but most wont because it requires the walk of shame.  Even if they hit a provisional, they have to go back and re-tee.

Meh.  I can't think of too many positions where it would be better to re-tee.  At worst, you take an unplayable and advance the ball.  Provisional is stroke + distance + having to re-hit the same shot you just knocked OB.  
The entire premise of aiming at a cart path is pretty ridiculous though.  Those things are maybe 6 feet wide and usually off to the side of the fairway.  If you miss a left cart path to the left, did you just hit it OB?  If you are so accurate that you can squarely hit a 6 foot wide ribbon from 200+ yards away, why aren't you aiming down the middle?  
There is a hole at my home course that has a pot bunker right in the middle of the fairway.  I always aim directly at it and have only hit it once.  

That's the reason I didn't post it.  In the worst case your stroke and distance which is the same as a lost ball.  Some of the courses I play have 3 foot high hay right now.  Your re-teeing if find the ball and more your more than two club lengths from an escape. But it just depends on who you play and where they hit their provisional ball. For instance, par 3, first ball flies into the long grass.  Provisional in the hole.  Are you going to look for the ball? Sure you are.  But in most cases were talking a very small advantage unless it phucks with the players head.

Only a short knocker would aim at a cart path. Not saying it's bad, it's just a fact of life.

To generalise, a short knocker is usually a bit more accurate than a bomber. With driver, anyway. Now there is nothing worse than a short knocker who hits it astray more than straight. Hell, if I couldn't hit my driver as straight as my 7 iron, I'd go ahead and make up a 46" long 8.5* head that I could hit fifty yards farther than what I've got. Using the blind squirrel finds nut principal, every once in awhile I'd have a wedge into a par 4 instead of a 5 iron. And if you're going to drive it into the drink or the shit, said drink or shit is less undesireable closer to the green.

Mongrel wrote:To generalise, a short knocker is usually a bit more accurate than a bomber. With driver, anyway. Now there is nothing worse than a short knocker who hits it astray more than straight. Hell, if I couldn't hit my driver as straight as my 7 iron, I'd go ahead and make up a 46" long 8.5* head that I could hit fifty yards farther than what I've got. Using the blind squirrel finds nut principal, every once in awhile I'd have a wedge into a par 4 instead of a 5 iron. And if you're going to drive it into the drink or the shit, said drink or shit is less undesireable closer to the green.

Hey, I've been beat by short knockers. A low HC short knocker is usually great with the fairway metals and can get up and down from everywhere. One the right course they have a true advantage. Just ask Zach Johnson.

A bomber, as you state, is less likely to hit a cart path because of geometry and physics, not necessarily because they are wild. A poorly hit shot has much bigger chance of finding the woods if you drive the ball 280 compared to 230. Plus many of the courses are designed to guard against a the longer hitters. I doubt many players that hit the ball 230 are taking on a dog leg.

Poe4soul wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Posting of a short knocker.  Miss a green by 20 yards going for the green in two from 250 out shouldn't result in a lost ball.  Especially when missing the green by 18 or 22 yards is an easy up and down for a birdie.  

Having to rely on a cart path to give extra distance means you should consider moving to the forward tees.  Unless a cart path crosses a fairway, no reasonable person would aim for said cart path.  The only exception I can think of is if you are playing in a scramble format and someone is in good position already. Or your you play a goat track that has no rough, water or hay.  Then the benefit might out way the penalty of missing the cart path.  

Don't know what kind of courses you play on but if you miss the green by 20 yards its either in the trap, ob or in the water and you damn well better have game to get a birdie.

jt1135 wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Posting of a short knocker.  Miss a green by 20 yards going for the green in two from 250 out shouldn't result in a lost ball.  Especially when missing the green by 18 or 22 yards is an easy up and down for a birdie.  

Having to rely on a cart path to give extra distance means you should consider moving to the forward tees.  Unless a cart path crosses a fairway, no reasonable person would aim for said cart path.  The only exception I can think of is if you are playing in a scramble format and someone is in good position already. Or your you play a goat track that has no rough, water or hay.  Then the benefit might out way the penalty of missing the cart path.  

Don't know what kind of courses you play on but if you miss the green by 20 yards its either in the trap, ob or in the water and you damn well better have game to get a birdie.

Agreed. 20 yards left, right, or long is probably dead. For me, if I am going for a green from 3 wood distance, there is usually at least 2 places you can miss without killing yourself. Either short or long, and either left or right. If all are trouble, I'm probably going to think twice about hitting the shot.

Horseballs wrote:

jt1135 wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Mongrel wrote:Long knockers who miss greens by a wide enough margin to hit asphalt cart paths and have their balls bound into the grunge should either club down or be sure to hit provisionals so as not to slow play.

Posting of a short knocker.  Miss a green by 20 yards going for the green in two from 250 out shouldn't result in a lost ball.  Especially when missing the green by 18 or 22 yards is an easy up and down for a birdie.  

Having to rely on a cart path to give extra distance means you should consider moving to the forward tees.  Unless a cart path crosses a fairway, no reasonable person would aim for said cart path.  The only exception I can think of is if you are playing in a scramble format and someone is in good position already. Or your you play a goat track that has no rough, water or hay.  Then the benefit might out way the penalty of missing the cart path.  

Don't know what kind of courses you play on but if you miss the green by 20 yards its either in the trap, ob or in the water and you damn well better have game to get a birdie.

Agreed.  20 yards left, right, or long is probably dead.  For me, if I am going for a green from 3 wood distance, there is usually at least 2 places you can miss without killing yourself.  Either short or long, and either left or right.  If all are trouble, I'm probably going to think twice about hitting the shot.  

Ok, maybe easy is the wrong word, but you still have a chance, sometimes good.

This happened to me in a tournament
[img][/img]

The cart path is only 20 yards from the center of the front opening of the green at it's close point. I hit the cart path and the ball ended up in the hazard behind the green. If I hit left or right of the path I would have been either in the bunker or pin high, the pin was back right. I was aiming for the left edge of the bunker. You can call it a shitty design, but a cart path is a random part of the game. You hit left or right of it and your fine, on it and you are more than likely fucked.