rant rant rant rant....Fking rant

Well, with your golf skills and size you are probably the largest target around. So given the societal and legal constraints, you have few options other than to find other people to play golf with, give up golf, or just smile and beat their asses every which way all the time every time.

On the distance measuring part. I bought a phone especially to have the gps function for free.... Got the application,works better then the golf gps devices,but dont use it.

When playing a course regularly one starts to know the distances. Even when playing a different course its easy to determine if a ball is lying downhill/uphill/sideways. Just add an estimate onto the distance marker for your lie and go for it.

I have a bad habbit of not even taking practise strokes as part of my pre-shot routine...I am going to conciously start trying to take one or two practise swings during my preshot routine. First one being the clubhead path in the swing, Second one being the complete shot as I am picturing the shot.

I think I may be the world's fastest putter....I dont walk sideways or look from the back at all. image the putt,line it up, still dont take a practise putt, and then just see the put go in,and make the stroke.


Below Tiger's putting stats for 2007,one of his better years....If the best golfer in the world has a 50% chance of sinking a 7-10'foot putt...Why would I take that much time on them,id rather take my time on shorter putts then 6'foot...bet again I have seen 27 handicappers almost commit suicide on the greens after missing a 30' foot putt....



Putting from Inside 5'

97.17%

17th


Putting from 5-10'

54.55%

131st

Putting from - 10-15'

35.96%

8th

Putting from - 15-20'

26.37%

5th

Putting from - 20-25'

14.52%

45th

Putting from - > 25'

6.81%

32nd

Putting from 5-15'

47.24%

61st

Putting from 15-25'

21.57%

9th

Putting from 3-5'

89.31%

41st

http://www.pgatour.com/players/player.08793.tiger-woods.html/performance-stats/#uber

Mostly German wrote:Well, with your golf skills and size you are probably the largest target around. So given the societal and legal constraints, you have few options other than to find other people to play golf with, give up golf, or just smile and beat their asses every which way all the time every time.

I hate it....

Not much you can do about it fluff. Some people are just assholes. Fluffy, I sure hope that isn't your job description.

Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

Fluffy wrote:

Mostly German wrote:When and if you get to be my age and can still play a bit of golf, you will be glad that there are younger guys with better eyesight in your group who will tell you where yours went. Might want to think about paying it forward.

My eyesight is already bad..Only got glasses last year after not wearing at all for +-24years. They picked up my eye problem at 6months old...thats another story.

Anyway If someone asks me on a certain shot or two I wouldnt mind, the same if I ask them on one or two. but intentionally swearing and turning backwards to hit your club on the ground then asking people where your ball went is not cutting it for me...not at all...

On putting greens people do it all the time when they hit their ball 2meters past the hole....I cant wait to mention "atleast you got a line back to the cup", just because I know they didnt look at their ball untill it stopped.

My brother has the same bad habit of not watching a bad drive, which is usually 2/3 of his drives. We spend about half the time looking for his shots, not actually playing golf.
I don't mind so much if the course isn't busy, but if we're a twosome and a foursome is up are rear, we have a problem Houston. So I had the proverbial talk with him, if you can't watch your sh!tty drives I'm not playing with you. Straightened him right out.

I usually help someone finding there ball, as long as its not in the woods, I get poison ivy pretty easy. Fuk that. Unless I'm super familiar with the area, and know what's in there, as far as plant life. I wear shorts whenever possible.

I am amazed everynow and then, last year at a rather upscale course. My buddy sprayed a drive long and right,
I'm knee high in grassy weeds there's 3 other guys looking around from the adjacent hole, looking around in the same area as us.
I holler over at one of them, after I found a ball, what are you playing? He says oh I'm not looking for my ball, I'm helping your buddy find his! It was a rockflite he hit, on a prov1 course.
Didn't ask they just jumped in the weeds and helped.

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

Fluffy wrote:

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

I could setup our measily short course in such a way that the pros would easily play 72,but birdie putts wouldnt drop at all. Remember they dont play off kikuyu grass and long-cut Poa grass...... There's alot more forgiveness off bermuda than kikuyu.The easiest greens I have played on where all the greens at the private courses, even with the slopes the ball doesnt bounce on the green when putting. No bounces=true roll....

Fluffy wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

I could setup our measily short course in such a way that the pros would easily play 72,but birdie putts wouldnt drop at all. Remember they dont play off kikuyu grass and long-cut Poa grass...... There's alot more forgiveness off bermuda than kikuyu. The easiest greens I have played on where all the greens at the private courses, even with the slopes the ball doesnt bounce on the green when putting. No bounces=true roll....

Very true. Talked to a few pro's that were on the PGA Tour and they said their per round putts dropped. They said every course is set up with almost identical conditions. The stimps are similar, the bunker sand is similar, etc. One said he dropped about a stroke per round from his average of his mini tour stats. That's huge for a plus cap.

Also, I've taken many vacations and played a week or so on courses that have great greens. They are rolled and very little play. By the end of the week I'm usually dropping putts that I would normally miss. I found that on good greens that roll true I could practice putting and get good feedback. When I practice on shitty greens I think I pulled the putt but the ball hit a bump and went off course. That can get me chasing my tail trying to adjust for what I thought was a poor stroke but was actually a bad bounce.

Poe4soul wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

I could setup our measily short course in such a way that the pros would easily play 72,but birdie putts wouldnt drop at all. Remember they dont play off kikuyu grass and long-cut Poa grass...... There's alot more forgiveness off bermuda than kikuyu. The easiest greens I have played on where all the greens at the private courses, even with the slopes the ball doesnt bounce on the green when putting. No bounces=true roll....

Very true. Talked to a few pro's that were on the PGA Tour and they said their per round putts dropped. They said every course is set up with almost identical conditions. The stimps are similar, the bunker sand is similar, etc. One said he dropped about a stroke per round from his average of his mini tour stats. That's huge for a plus cap.

Also, I've taken many vacations and played a week or so on courses that have great greens. They are rolled and very little play. By the end of the week I'm usually dropping putts that I would normally miss. I found that on good greens that roll true I could practice putting and get good feedback. When I practice on shitty greens I think I pulled the putt but the ball hit a bump and went off course. That can get me chasing my tail trying to adjust for what I thought was a poor stroke but was actually a bad bounce.

Get real. If you played the same courses the pros play, under the same conditions they play them, you would shoot much higher scores than you do on the normal tracks you play, even if you played from your normal set of tees. The rough is higher, the greens are extremely fast and the fairways are narrower. Scott McCarron came out to the course I used to play and shot the course record, 62, the first time he played it. He just came out with a friend on a normal day in the afternoon, when the Poa Anna greens were bumpy and fairway grass wasn't normal tour conditions.

I think slow greens are quite easy to putt and I almost never 3 putt them. I'm talking good condition greens that are just a tiny bit bumpy, not some executive course.

I've talked to people who have played Torrey Pines South the day after the pros finish the Buick Invitational there. One guy is a scratch handicap, played the same tee boxes the pros play and shot 92. He said it was next to impossible to play it.

On fast greens, I played golf one time with a guy who has played Augusta National a few times. This guy is a good player, probably a 7 handicap, and he said that it's very easy to 3 putt every single green.

Sure, well mown - fast greens provide for a truer roll of the ball. However, it's also very easy to 3 putt on extremely fast greens. Personally, my favorite greens are Poa Anna. The ball stops a foot away from where you land your irons shots, they are usual plush and if mown that morning they roll very well. It's only in the afternoon that Poa Anna greens get bumpy and if you're playing at that time you're a hack anyway.

I really think it depends on the slope/firmness in the greens when they are fast. The SPCC is a 1910 Donald Ross course that has about 12 greens with elephants buried in them. We also keep the greens running fast during the season. It's pretty easy to look like an idiot on downhill putts or big breakers. On the 6 or so less sloped greens, putts can be made from anywhere, and 3 putts require true mistakes.
The worst thing for me is when the greens get overly firm. I'm not a big "fairways hit" guy, more of a bomb and gauge style of player. If I can't hold iron shots on the green out of the rough, it's going to be a long day. I've always measured good drives as being good length, decent direction, and unimpeded shot to the green. Fairways are a bonus. I wish I was a bit more consistently in the fairway, to be honest, but I don't think I'm going to magically get a couple more hours in the week to spend on golf.

Horseballs wrote:I really think it depends on the slope/firmness in the greens when they are fast. The SPCC is a 1910 Donald Ross course that has about 12 greens with elephants buried in them. We also keep the greens running fast during the season. It's pretty easy to look like an idiot on downhill putts or big breakers. On the 6 or so less sloped greens, putts can be made from anywhere, and 3 putts require true mistakes.
The worst thing for me is when the greens get overly firm. I'm not a big "fairways hit" guy, more of a bomb and gauge style of player. If I can't hold iron shots on the green out of the rough, it's going to be a long day. I've always measured good drives as being good length, decent direction, and unimpeded shot to the green. Fairways are a bonus. I wish I was a bit more consistently in the fairway, to be honest, but I don't think I'm going to magically get a couple more hours in the week to spend on golf.

Sounds about right. Some days I'm just hoping for a back swing and will be happy to have a clear look at the green. I think most golfers that can work the ball learn to out of necessity.

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

I could setup our measily short course in such a way that the pros would easily play 72,but birdie putts wouldnt drop at all. Remember they dont play off kikuyu grass and long-cut Poa grass...... There's alot more forgiveness off bermuda than kikuyu. The easiest greens I have played on where all the greens at the private courses, even with the slopes the ball doesnt bounce on the green when putting. No bounces=true roll....

Very true. Talked to a few pro's that were on the PGA Tour and they said their per round putts dropped. They said every course is set up with almost identical conditions. The stimps are similar, the bunker sand is similar, etc. One said he dropped about a stroke per round from his average of his mini tour stats. That's huge for a plus cap.

Also, I've taken many vacations and played a week or so on courses that have great greens. They are rolled and very little play. By the end of the week I'm usually dropping putts that I would normally miss. I found that on good greens that roll true I could practice putting and get good feedback. When I practice on shitty greens I think I pulled the putt but the ball hit a bump and went off course. That can get me chasing my tail trying to adjust for what I thought was a poor stroke but was actually a bad bounce.

Get real. If you played the same courses the pros play, under the same conditions they play them, you would shoot much higher scores than you do on the normal tracks you play, even if you played from your normal set of tees. The rough is higher, the greens are extremely fast and the fairways are narrower. Scott McCarron came out to the course I used to play and shot the course record, 62, the first time he played it. He just came out with a friend on a normal day in the afternoon, when the Poa Anna greens were bumpy and fairway grass wasn't normal tour conditions.

I think slow greens are quite easy to putt and I almost never 3 putt them. I'm talking good condition greens that are just a tiny bit bumpy, not some executive course.

I've talked to people who have played Torrey Pines South the day after the pros finish the Buick Invitational there. One guy is a scratch handicap, played the same tee boxes the pros play and shot 92. He said it was next to impossible to play it.

On fast greens, I played golf one time with a guy who has played Augusta National a few times. This guy is a good player, probably a 7 handicap, and he said that it's very easy to 3 putt every single green.

Sure, well mown - fast greens provide for a truer roll of the ball. However, it's also very easy to 3 putt on extremely fast greens. Personally, my favorite greens are Poa Anna. The ball stops a foot away from where you land your irons shots, they are usual plush and if mown that morning they roll very well. It's only in the afternoon that Poa Anna greens get bumpy and if you're playing at that time you're a hack anyway.

So actually I can Insinuate double here; Being that the pros are all +10 handicaps on our normal courses.....And this on average bouncy greens and kikuyu grass....I Played with a few +handicaps, now pro golfers on our circuit and they also mentioned that the courses are far,FAR easier on tour. The day I played with them both shot over 72 on their home course..... Three weeks later they where shooting 66/64's on the tour...

Id rather have a fast slippery put on a true line then a slow easy put that I have no-idea which way its going to bounce....

Fluffy wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Fluffy wrote:

Player wrote:Hey fluff dont get too carried away with pga tour putting stats cause they can distort the truth. Tiger's stats are for tour greens and pins on courses he only plays once a year. If they played our courses with slow putts without much break week after week I guaramtee most tour pro would be running over 75% on 10 footers. Every stat for pga tour needs to be put in context. Their play is way more impressive than the raw data suggests.

I disagree about the "tour greens" I would trade it up without blinking for our courses' greens. Remember the ball doesnt bounce on their greens when the put is rolling...I played a bad 77 this saterday,but I had 5 putts within 5-6 feet that went and layed just on the lip. after completing the hole I pressed down on my line to feel the grain and it was around 1-2mm longer here and there in patches.....

I phucking hate slow greens.

I could setup our measily short course in such a way that the pros would easily play 72,but birdie putts wouldnt drop at all. Remember they dont play off kikuyu grass and long-cut Poa grass...... There's alot more forgiveness off bermuda than kikuyu. The easiest greens I have played on where all the greens at the private courses, even with the slopes the ball doesnt bounce on the green when putting. No bounces=true roll....

Very true. Talked to a few pro's that were on the PGA Tour and they said their per round putts dropped. They said every course is set up with almost identical conditions. The stimps are similar, the bunker sand is similar, etc. One said he dropped about a stroke per round from his average of his mini tour stats. That's huge for a plus cap.

Also, I've taken many vacations and played a week or so on courses that have great greens. They are rolled and very little play. By the end of the week I'm usually dropping putts that I would normally miss. I found that on good greens that roll true I could practice putting and get good feedback. When I practice on shitty greens I think I pulled the putt but the ball hit a bump and went off course. That can get me chasing my tail trying to adjust for what I thought was a poor stroke but was actually a bad bounce.

Get real. If you played the same courses the pros play, under the same conditions they play them, you would shoot much higher scores than you do on the normal tracks you play, even if you played from your normal set of tees. The rough is higher, the greens are extremely fast and the fairways are narrower. Scott McCarron came out to the course I used to play and shot the course record, 62, the first time he played it. He just came out with a friend on a normal day in the afternoon, when the Poa Anna greens were bumpy and fairway grass wasn't normal tour conditions.

I think slow greens are quite easy to putt and I almost never 3 putt them. I'm talking good condition greens that are just a tiny bit bumpy, not some executive course.

I've talked to people who have played Torrey Pines South the day after the pros finish the Buick Invitational there. One guy is a scratch handicap, played the same tee boxes the pros play and shot 92. He said it was next to impossible to play it.

On fast greens, I played golf one time with a guy who has played Augusta National a few times. This guy is a good player, probably a 7 handicap, and he said that it's very easy to 3 putt every single green.

Sure, well mown - fast greens provide for a truer roll of the ball. However, it's also very easy to 3 putt on extremely fast greens. Personally, my favorite greens are Poa Anna. The ball stops a foot away from where you land your irons shots, they are usual plush and if mown that morning they roll very well. It's only in the afternoon that Poa Anna greens get bumpy and if you're playing at that time you're a hack anyway.

So actually I can Insinuate double here; Being that the pros are all +10 handicaps on our normal courses.....And this on average bouncy greens and kikuyu grass....I Played with a few +handicaps, now pro golfers on our circuit and they also mentioned that the courses are far,FAR easier on tour. The day I played with them both shot over 72 on their home course..... Three weeks later they where shooting 66/64's on the tour...

Id rather have a fast slippery put on a true line then a slow easy put that I have no-idea which way its going to bounce....

I call BS. You say your tour pro friends shoot higher scores on regular golf courses than they do on tour? Not.

Nick Watney is from Sacramento (like me) and some local kid from high school had won an 18 hole round with him through a charity event. They played a country club that is just outside of San Francisco in the month of December. Watney shot a 64. I've heard countless stories like this when a tour pro plays a normal course with normal setup for amateurs. They tear it apart.

Take a look at the courses that Jack Nicklaus, Ben Hogan and Arnold Palmer used to play. Those are much worse than the courses I play today. Yet, they holed putts from everywhere.

In every golfing group I've ever been a part of, there is always the one guy who complains about the greens. He'll complain that they should have been verticut or about some kind of fungus that's developing. Next, he puts down the superintendent.

FamousDavis wrote:I call BS. You say your tour pro friends shoot higher scores on regular golf courses than they do on tour? Not.

Nick Watney is from Sacramento (like me) and some local kid from high school had won an 18 hole round with him through a charity event. They played a country club that is just outside of San Francisco in the month of December. Watney shot a 64. I've heard countless stories like this when a tour pro plays a normal course with normal setup for amateurs. They tear it apart.

Take a look at the courses that Jack Nicklaus, Ben Hogan and Arnold Palmer used to play. Those are much worse than the courses I play today. Yet, they holed putts from everywhere.

In every golfing group I've ever been a part of, there is always the one guy who complains about the greens. He'll complain that they should have been verticut or about some kind of fungus that's developing. Next, he puts down the superintendent.

Not necessarily. I would admit its alot easier especially when the pros come and drive 270m in the middle on every hole. Obviously you are talking sw into the green on 10 holes of the course...Their proximity to the hole will be closer but I bet you they would still prefer their tours greens as an everyday playing course rather then your local no-name tracks....

The day the guys played with me the one was lucky enough to hole 4 putts from 6-9 meters... Didnt miss on any 3 footers,but they did mention the fear on the local tracks for those 5-8 footers. If theres a patch on grass unequally cut it will take your ball....Whereto is not upto you:)

Played with a guy this weekend who was a 12 handicap, quite good...Had 5x3 putts.....Not once did he complain about the greens...coincidence....I think not.

I can chip better on the greens then long puts myself.lol.If its raining medium to heavy I would chip a 5meter putt...

No way in the world pros shoot lower on tour than at member/guest days. Anyone who would even suggest this has never played a real tourney. I hear stories all the time oguys like baker-finch and ogle shooting lights out in mid week comps, and they ara million miles away from being tour players. Even for open amatjer events the greens and pin placements are hellish, tour greens and pins are close to unplayable for amatuers. I think fluff fails to appreciate just how good the top 125 players in the world actually are. I would guess there would have to be at least 50 million golfers in the world. Even at that conservative est. that wouldmean to make the pga tour would make you a one in nearly half a milion player. You are dreaming fluff. Any pga pro could come to your piss ant course and destroy the course record on their first outing. Its not the course, its the fact we are all hackers compared to tour players

I'll take my punishment and relieve myself of this conversation....You win.

Fluffy wrote:I'll take my punishment and relieve myself of this conversation....You win.

It's not about win or lose... it's about who has a thicker skin
Debate is healthy... unless one side is trying to kick the other side out,,, discussing issues is OK ,attacking personnel is not OK... Can we all get along? (remember that guy?)