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    13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

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    Pky6471

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    13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sat Sep 13, 2014 8:36 am

    Guys/ Girls/ AC-DC and all Pros out there

    Not sure why (getting old for one thing) I am not comfortable hitting my 3W off the deck anymore. The confidence is gone. So I play my 17* gaybrid a lot from fairways. I still carry my 15-16* 3W for T-shots when needed....

    I still have my Olimar 13* 3W which I will use at the next round on Monday for T off when needed. I also have 12* Cally BB ÌI driver which I could cut down or choke down to 3W length for T off. besides the fact that the driver would have a bigger sweet spot. What are pros and cons of these 2 options (cut 12* driver to 3W length would screw up its balance ?)

    Thanks
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sat Sep 13, 2014 11:31 am

    The high-lofted driver cut down to fairway wood length is frequently referred to as a "thriver". The subject of thrivers has been beaten to death on other golf forums like our old home GR as well as GolfWRX and others. I would opt for cutting down your driver. In order to maintain its balance, you would need to add weight to the driver's head. Lead tape is the usual method. Instead of measuring the swingweight as-is and then adding the formulaicly determined amount of weight, I would just cut it down and take it and a roll of lead tape to the range. Hit it and then add a one inch strip of tape and hit it again. Repeat until it feels good.

    The other thing you could do is to put another shaft in that head cut to shorter length. I did this with a 905R 11.5* head I have. Instead of lead tape, I put a steel Dynamic Gold R300 in it cut to play at 43". It works pretty good as a fairway finder. Better than any 3 wood or hybrid I have. Despite the loft difference, I hit my 9.5* graphite shafted drivers higher (and farther) than my Steel 905R.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sat Sep 13, 2014 12:00 pm

    Mongrel wrote:The high-lofted driver cut down to fairway wood length is frequently referred to as a "thriver". The subject of thrivers has been beaten to death on other golf forums like our old home GR as well as GolfWRX and others. I would opt for cutting down your driver. In order to maintain its balance, you would need to add weight to the driver's head. Lead tape is the usual method. Instead of measuring the swingweight as-is and then adding the formulaicly determined amount of weight, I would just cut it down and take it and a roll of lead tape to the range. Hit it and then add a one inch strip of tape and hit it again. Repeat until it feels good.

    The other thing you could do is to put another shaft in that head cut to shorter length. I did this with a 905R 11.5* head I have. Instead of lead tape, I put a steel Dynamic Gold R300 in it cut to play at 43". It works pretty good as a fairway finder. Better than any 3 wood or hybrid I have. Despite the loft difference, I hit my 9.5* graphite shafted drivers higher (and farther) than my Steel 905R.

    9.5* graphite shafted driver should be longer than >>> 11.5* shorter steel shaft Laughing

    I played my Tit 9.5* 905-R NV stiff shafted driver yesterday and still love it ( As much as my Cally Diablo tour edge)... I am going to test my 13* Olimar 3W off the T on Monday
    Thanks
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sat Sep 13, 2014 3:24 pm

    If you love that 905R, you might want to look for an old Titleist 904F in 13*. That is a really nice head and you could pound it with the right shaft.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sat Sep 13, 2014 3:44 pm

    Mongrel wrote:If you love that 905R, you might want to look for an old Titleist 904F in 13*. That is a really nice head and you could pound it with the right shaft.

    Thanks Mongrel... I love NV green shaft and that gives me the confidence with the Tit 905R. That shaft (in any club) never fails me
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    trombettista_vecchio

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  trombettista_vecchio on Sat Sep 13, 2014 10:48 pm

    NV Green is a great shaft, both the 85g and the 105g...on irons. I've had those on several sets. Never on woods, though. I like a lower kick on woods.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:30 pm

    trombettista_vecchio wrote:NV Green is a great shaft, both the 85g and the 105g...on irons. I've had those on several sets.  Never on woods, though. I like a lower kick on woods.

    I would like to try them on my irons sets but I am too cheap to try Razz ... I just have them (come as-is from eBay) on Tit 905R driver and TEE CB1 3W... both 65 gms. very responsive shaft for my swing
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:40 pm

    I've never had a club with that green NV shaft but my newest hybrid, and Adams Idea Super Hybrid 19*, has a stiff Voodoo green shaft with the NV profile based on its model nomenclature SNV8. About 85 grams with a high kick point. Not the smoothest feel but it sure keeps ball flight down and it is the straightest hybrid I ever hit. Two weeks ago, I came to a real b!tch of a par 4 on one of our rota of courses. It doglegs left with the second shot needing to carry a large pond to a shallow green. The fairway and rough runs out straight off the tee about 210 yards so driver is out. This is a hole that I usually consider a double bogey to be my personal par. Anyway, I take this hybrid off the tee and hit it a bit thin but straight leaving me around 175 to the middle of the green.Since the course's fairways are all bent grass that is overwatered and mown way too low, the lie was very tight and I figured my chances of clearing the pond with any iron were slim at best. So I took this Adams Super Hybrid and choked down about two inches (stock club length is 41" and I have not cut it down--yet.) and hit it with a hard punch type swing that produced a low cruise missile trajectory that carried the pond, landed on the green and stayed on. When I got up to the green, I saw my pitch mark and the ball only ran out about 6 feet. That low sucker must have had a bunch of backspin.

    So I proceeded to three putt from about 30 feet with the first putt a slight downhill left to righter. In fact, I three-putted about ten greens that day even though they were slow from having been aerated two weeks before and rolled pretty well and true. The first thing I did was to totally change my putting method and the first step was to obtain the proper putter for what I was trying to accomplish. The day after that round, I went to the local Play It Again Sports store and bought a totally original Ping My Day that appears to be a late 1960's vintage. The head is manganese bronze and it is very dark with that classic patina. The grip appears to be the original skinny Ping grip. In fact, the white paper label is still on the side of the grip. I was going to change the grip or at least remove the label but I think I'll leave it alone for Mojo Retention purposes.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sun Sep 14, 2014 2:59 pm

    Mongrel... We are going to play here on 9/28- A charity tourney for poor kids in VN ... Probably it's not too far from your place

    http://www.lakepresidential.com/golf.html#public-rates

    http://vimeo.com/24886665

    BTW, I have my 13* Olimar 3W in my bag for tomorrow, Have not touched this club in year, will be using it at a couple holes for T-off,  I know where about I normally land my golf ball ....

    Welllllll ... I am glad that i did not throw out my very old 13* Olimar 3W. I hit it almost "perfect" off the Ts yesterday... It felt funny at first because when I looked down at the Ts its head is too darn small by today's standard, but I was pleased.... perhaps it's just a honey period again. I will look into more up-to-date 13* 3W for off the Ts, if the price is right.
    Any suggestion?
    thanks guys/girls/AC-DC


    Last edited by Pky6471 on Tue Sep 16, 2014 5:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sun Sep 14, 2014 3:54 pm

    That's in Upper Marlboro, Prince George's County. About an hour south of me. I never played it but looked at its website and it looks cool. You should have fun. I remember when I used to work in the private real estate industry and would frequently have assignments in southern Maryland. I met some Vietnamese who fled in the 1970's before the fall of Saigon and established businesses here in the USA. One guy had a restaurant in an out of the way little village not far from where you are going to play golf. I was the only one in his cafe and I had lunch and talked with him for quite awhile. He was the tallest Vietnamese male I ever met at around my height of six feet. He was ARVN special forces and I could tell he was a very good guy.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:18 am

    just eBayed 13* 3W Cleveland Launcher S-flex... Should work out OK. The "thriver" idea is good, but I am afraid it could be out-of-balance to cut a driver to 3W length. I am pretty I could get used to this club, hopefully it's better than the current 13* 3W Olimar in my bag
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    Horseballs

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Horseballs on Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:31 am

    That Orlimar is really shallow faced, right? I have an irrational fear of popping up shallow faced woods off the tee. I guess they are supposed to be easier to hit of the deck, but I almost exclusively use my 3 wood off the tee.
    I agree that the thriver sounds like a better option for you. Mongrel, if you cut from the butt end of the shaft, wouldn't it make sense to add a counter-balance weight to the grip end?
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:49 am

    If you cut the shaft down on a club, its swingweight will decrease. If you add more weight to the butt end, the swingweight will decrease further. The typical compensation for a cut-down club is to add weight to the clubhead end to bring the swingweight back up. The reality is that you cut it, hit it, and add weight until it feels good and you can hit it consistently. Counterweighting is usually down when you want to play a longer shaft and the back weight brings the swingweight down to where it was with the shorter shaft. It is also used to dial in impact so that you hit the sweet spot more consistently. Its fun to mess around with a driver using impact tape and differnt amounts of back weights.

    As for the Orlimars, I had a Tight Lies 3 wood that this guy insisted on giving me for nothing after I had appraised his commercial property for his Bankuptcy Trustee. I really didn't trust him since he was the debtor and I was working for the Court but after about thirty minutes' worth of his cajoling, I took the club. Worst POS I ever tried. I would sky the damn ball from a tight fairway lie and forget about off the tee or light rough. Of course I'm more of a digger and need irons, hybrids or deep-faced fairway woods to be able to play those shots.

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    Horseballs

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Horseballs on Wed Sep 17, 2014 8:30 am

    Mongrel wrote:If you cut the shaft down on a club, its swingweight will decrease. If you add more weight to the butt end, the swingweight will decrease further. The typical compensation for a cut-down club is to add weight to the clubhead end to bring the swingweight back up. The reality is that you cut it, hit it, and add weight until it feels good and you can hit it consistently. Counterweighting is usually down when you want to play a longer shaft and the back weight brings the swingweight down to where it was with the shorter shaft. It is also used to dial in impact so that you hit the sweet spot more consistently. Its fun to mess around with a driver using impact tape and differnt amounts of back weights.

    As for the Orlimars, I had a Tight Lies 3 wood that this guy insisted on giving me for nothing after I had appraised his commercial property for his Bankuptcy Trustee. I really didn't trust him since he was the debtor and I was working for the Court but after about thirty minutes' worth of his cajoling, I took the club. Worst POS I ever tried. I would sky the damn ball from a tight fairway lie and forget about off the tee or light rough. Of course I'm more of a digger and need irons, hybrids or deep-faced fairway woods to be able to play those shots.

    I see. I think lead tape would be the death of me. I have avoided all adjustable clubs on purpose. I think I would be constantly tinkering. Lead tape allows for unlimited tinkering.
    I think everyone who played this game in the 90's had at least one those Tight Lies clubs.
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Wed Sep 17, 2014 8:54 am

    I will not have one of those adjustable clubs because I don't trust that many parts that can move over time under prolonged stress. As for lead tape, when I add some to a driver head or iron head and decide to leave it there, I will take my small machinist ruler and rub the tape into the head until it is smooth. Takes awhile but works great. And is always removeable.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Wed Sep 17, 2014 5:48 pm

    Horseballs wrote:That Orlimar is really shallow faced, right?  I have an irrational fear of popping up shallow faced woods off the tee.  I guess they are supposed to be easier to hit of the deck, but I almost exclusively use my 3 wood off the tee.  
    I agree that the thriver sounds like a better option for you.  Mongrel, if you cut from the butt end of the shaft, wouldn't it make sense to add a counter-balance weight to the grip end?  

    yes, it has a shallow face , but never pop a ball... My ego set in yrs ago , about 15 yrs or so ago I thought I could get more distance with more "roll", how stupid... no hang time = no distance, end of story... but I hit it off the T quite OK, I am hoping that the 13* Cleveland launcher 3W would be a better club for me since its face is not as shallow and it comes with S-shaft... will see. I take a 'less risk' route and hope for better results
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:29 am

    I have, I think, four of those Cleveland Launcher fairway woods. Two 15* 3 woods and two 19* five woods. I have so many clubs that when I tried to find one of them a couple of days ago, I couldn't. I know they're somewhere on the Mongrel Premises. One of those 3 woods and 5 woods have the titanium heads. From the early 200's. Those are a bit hotter than the steel headed ones. All of them came with the proprietary Fuji shafts in that gold color. Three of the four are stiff flex and play like everyone else's regular flex. I hit some good shots with the TI 3 wood but some bad ones too and it never made it into the bag after one round.

    Last night I made another fairway finder driver. It is not a thriver because the head is a Titleist 983K 9.5*. I pulled the Dynamic Gold R300 from my 905R and glued it into the K head. Its just under 43.5". Hopefully it will be my Stinger Special.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:02 am

    Mongrel wrote:I have, I think, four of those Cleveland Launcher fairway woods. Two 15* 3 woods and two 19* five woods. I have so many clubs that when I tried to find one of them a couple of days ago, I couldn't. I know they're somewhere on the Mongrel Premises. One of those 3 woods and 5 woods have the titanium heads. From the early 200's. Those are a bit hotter than the steel headed ones. All of them came with the proprietary Fuji shafts in that gold color. Three of the four are stiff flex and play like everyone else's regular flex. I hit some good shots with the TI 3 wood but some bad ones too and it never made it into the bag after one round.

    Last night I made another fairway finder driver. It is not a thriver because the head is a Titleist 983K 9.5*. I pulled the Dynamic Gold R300 from my 905R and glued it into the K head. Its just under 43.5". Hopefully it will be my Stinger Special.

    Mongrel... I like the way you fukkkk around with golf clubs... Tit 983K was a great club from reviewers, never had one. Tit 905R gives me great result (with NV Green S-shaft) so I am not in a hurry to try another one. I hope the 13* Cleveland Launcher 3W would do well for me - although the 13* Olimar 3W did better than expected for me off the Ts (only) last Monday ... There is a course in PA (Chisel Creek) at the border of PA/DE, short (5900 from white Ts) but PLENTY of trouble to get into. Hole # 12 -par4 - requires 2 STRAIGHT shots or you would be dead , how often could we do that.  It's where I need a straight/long enough shot off the T followed by a straight gaybrid shot to carry a high grass/wetland area to front of the green.  NEVER had a birdie here and lost quite a few balls .... Sh$$$$$t

    How do you determine 43.5"? from where to where to be exact.
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:25 am

    Yes, the K is a very good head. Many top pros used that head after it came out around 2003. Els, Scott, Phil, etc. Adam Scott played his with a steel shaft. I bought my first one used for about $70 around 2005. It had a Prolite 3.5 stiff that was a beast of a shaft for me but when I managed to load and unload good, the ball just rocketed off the head, carried on a flat trajectory, and ran for yards when it hit. I bought a second one a year after that with a softer shaft and gave the Prolite 3.5 shaft club to my son. The first hole we played he hit it about 325 that included a lot of roll. The last one I bought was a couple of years ago in the Golf Galaxy. It is a 9.5* like all my others and had a factory installed YS-6 stiff in it. It was the original YS-6 that was almost black and not the newer blue ones. It was $9.97 and I bought it for that shaft. Now the shaft has long since be relegated into the Never Again bin but that head is now firmly attached to the Dynamic Gold R300.

    The main reason I got into messing with clubs was that it got too expensive to take stuff to Golf Galaxy or some other shop and telll the guy what I wanted. Most of the times, the guys would laugh at me and tell me I was crazy to do this or that. Several times, the guy would refuse to do what I wanted. So I said to myself "fukk them", I they won't do it I'll do it myself. If this steel shafted 983K does not do what I want it to do, I'll just pull that shaft and put it into another driver head. Costs me about two cents for the propane in the torch and about thirty cents for the epoxy I'd use. Oh, maybe another five or six bucks if I end up trimming the butt and want another grip.

    And equally or more important than the cost is the time. You take a club to a shop for a modification and sometimes its a week or more for the guy to do it. If I want to reshaft a club or cut it down, it would take me a couple of minutes to cut a shaft butt and regrip it or maybe half an hour to pull and shaft and install another one. And another hour or so for the epoxy to set and overnight to cure just to be safe.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Fri Sep 19, 2014 6:31 am

    If I found a Tit 983K driver with 13* head AND NV Green shaft I would buy that in a heart beat and cut it down to the 3W length
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Fri Sep 19, 2014 8:08 am

    The max loft made in the K head was 11.5* like most all Titleist drivers from Day 1. The exception is the 975J, a sweet little 310 c.c. head that also came in 12.5*. If I ever see one of those, I will snap it up. I have two 975J heads lying around. An 8.5* and a 10.5*. I was debating whether to put the DG R300 into the 10.5* head but decided to try the K first. Back in its day pre-983, the 975J and JVS were clubs used by some of the PGA bombers.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Fri Sep 19, 2014 3:16 pm

    Mongrel wrote:The max loft made in the K head was 11.5* like most all Titleist drivers from Day 1. The exception is the 975J, a sweet little 310 c.c. head that also came in 12.5*. If I ever see one of those, I will snap it up. I have two 975J heads lying around. An 8.5* and a 10.5*. I was debating whether to put the DG R300 into the 10.5* head but decided to try the K first. Back in its day pre-983, the 975J and JVS were clubs used by some of the PGA bombers.

    Maybe I would check Golf Smith this weekend Mad

    Mongrel... Perhaps you could buy this head, put in a NV green shaft & cut it to 3W length
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/POWERBUILT-DYNASTY-13-DEGREE-TI-FACE-DRIVER-OR-FAIRWAY-STRONG-FAIRWAY-WOOD-350-/120747284591?pt=Golf_Clubmaking_Products_US&hash=item1c1d19586f
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sat Sep 20, 2014 8:44 am

    Not for me. I'd want an all titanium head. I'm headed out now to hit my 983K reshafted with steel for the first time. It is 9.5* which I'm hoping is enough to get a low boring stinger-like trajectory with enough spin to keep the ball in the air and a shallow enough landing angle to get some good run.
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    Pky6471

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Pky6471 on Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:56 am

    Mongrel wrote:Not for me. I'd want an all titanium head. I'm headed out now to hit my 983K reshafted with steel for the first time. It is 9.5* which I'm hoping is enough to get a low boring stinger-like trajectory with enough spin to keep the ball in the air and a shallow enough landing angle to get some good run.
    Hope U like it, if not, U may want to find a cheap/pulled NV green S-flex shaft for that head
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    Mongrel

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

    Post  Mongrel on Sat Sep 20, 2014 12:11 pm

    I like it a lot. It feels great. I hit about 30 balls at the range of a local course and did not top or pop-up one shot. The first several were weak slices but when I took a full swing, the ball flew straight on a medium high trajectory with a fade tail. Just how I like it. Unfortunately, my bad eyesight precluded seeing how far they went but I could catch the balls in flight to their apexes which seemed about normal for me and my drivers. The best part was that every shot was inside the small sweet spot circle in the center of the 983K club face. This tells me that the length and weight are pretty much spot on. I hit this 9.5* 365 c.c. head higher and more solidly than I did when the shaft was in the 905R 460 c.c. head at 11.5*. We have a winner.

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    Re: 13* 3W vs. 12*-13* driver cut down to 3W length

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