The best steroid documentary I have seen,links...

DO TAKE THE TIME TO WATCH IT,

Interesting and put into perspective in an understanding way. Alot of examples being made of of steroids in sports and interviews as well...

..

Part1:


Part2:

I have just learned that steroids make you hit consistent and improves your accuracy by 300%.....


Yeah right.....WTF does steroids contribute to a sport where hand & eye coordination is everything and the only thing?

Listening to the golf channel and they are talking about steroids and VJ etc...

I think if you can afford HGH you should be allowed to use it...$9000 for a few weeks....Go for it.

HGH isnt even the strongest steroid....It does help with your organs alot,its more of an health beneficial thing. obviously some hard training would gain you some muscle but not that noticable...

Fluffy, it doesn't bother me in the least that you do steroids.

I think that its great that the Steroid Industry figured out that deer antler extract was a natural substitute for the pharmaceuticals. It is coming out in the News right now that several high profile pro athletes have been using this deer antler extract to help speed recovery of their various performance-impeding injuries. Vijay Singh is the PGA star and Ray Lewis of the Ravens in the NFL is currently the primary focus leading up to the Superbowl this Sunday. I have no problem with any of these guys using the deer antler extract. However, they should be careful running across roadways during rutting. Of course if every pro starts using this stuff, the old buzzword "Ho's" will be replaced with "Does."

Horseballs wrote:Fluffy, it doesn't bother me in the least that you do steroids.

Wish I knew a dealer were I live. Would love some Clenbuterol....Weight loss steroid. I lost around 12kg in 3 weeks when I used it 2 years ago. When your 125kg believe me you dont want to get bigger...I already have an achilles tendon problem.

Clenbuterol mostly used in drugs for horse aspiration problems.....

Mostly German wrote:I think that its great that the Steroid Industry figured out that deer antler extract was a natural substitute for the pharmaceuticals. It is coming out in the News right now that several high profile pro athletes have been using this deer antler extract to help speed recovery of their various performance-impeding injuries. Vijay Singh is the PGA star and Ray Lewis of the Ravens in the NFL is currently the primary focus leading up to the Superbowl this Sunday. I have no problem with any of these guys using the deer antler extract. However, they should be careful running across roadways during rutting. Of course if every pro starts using this stuff, the old buzzword "Ho's" will be replaced with "Does."

Dear Antler Spray.....sound very gay for a performance enhancement drug....Sound like some sort of Hillbilly lubricant....

I've been hitting the gym again but this time around I decided beforehand to be extremely careful. I use dumbbells for bench, incline and military, which has taken a lot of the strain off of my shoulders (rotator cuff). I use the weight machines with pulleys for all three 'row' exercises and then use a curl bar for triceps and biceps. Then I go back to the dumbbells for more bicep work and do some forearm stuff.

I have found that whenever I'm going to the gym on a regular basis and working with weights it seems like my little aches and pains go away. My back no longer bothers me and my muscles and tendons seem to pop less. I'm going to start incorporating some running on the days I'm not lifting but that's going to be a slow process. I'm going to do it right and go to Roadrunner Sports to get properly fitted based on my footfall and size. I've got a high-arched foot and I'm an efficient runner but when I start out there is pain at the top of my foot.

Golf is always better when I work out. Not during the first two weeks but definitely thereafter.

FamousDavis wrote:I've been hitting the gym again but this time around I decided beforehand to be extremely careful. I use dumbbells for bench, incline and military, which has taken a lot of the strain off of my shoulders (rotator cuff). I use the weight machines with pulleys for all three 'row' exercises and then use a curl bar for triceps and biceps. Then I go back to the dumbbells for more bicep work and do some forearm stuff.

I have found that whenever I'm going to the gym on a regular basis and working with weights it seems like my little aches and pains go away. My back no longer bothers me and my muscles and tendons seem to pop less. I'm going to start incorporating some running on the days I'm not lifting but that's going to be a slow process. I'm going to do it right and go to Roadrunner Sports to get properly fitted based on my footfall and size. I've got a high-arched foot and I'm an efficient runner but when I start out there is pain at the top of my foot.

Golf is always better when I work out. Not during the first two weeks but definitely thereafter.

Every year, I work out pretty regularly in the winter. I have been working out about 4 or 5 days per week, with the main focus on strength training and core work. I always enjoy strength work, but I really need to start doing more of the stuff I hate before golf season starts. Cardio and stretching.
I figure I'll ditch a couple strength days and add a yoga class (hatred, but the only effective stretching I've found), and a running day.
There is a class at my athletic club that I took last Sunday with the wife. 1.5 hours, with .5 hour plyo, weights/balance, and spinning. A lot of cyclists are in this class. I'm pretty sure they bike because they are weaklings and can't do anything normal that requires athleticism. You should have seen them trying to do pushups.

I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

It's certainly a good thing we didn't take our hiatus to a gay sex review forum.

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

Horseballs wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

It's certainly a good thing we didn't take our hiatus to a gay sex review forum.

You mean an MMA forum?

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

Dumbell rows don't really do too much. I know this as fact, plus in order to get any benefit to dumbell rows, you need very heavy weights. Heavier than you'd need for a home gym.
Pull ups are the best lat exercise, and if you are having problems with your rotator cuff, you aren't doing them correctly. You should control the movement throughout and not bounce at the bottom. Plus, you should perform a scapular retraction prior to pulling up, which reduces any shoulder tension.

Fluffy wrote:I have just learned that steroids make you hit consistent and improves your accuracy by 300%.....


Yeah right.....WTF does steroids contribute to a sport where hand & eye coordination is everything and the only thing?

Once you've watched VJ practice you'll realize how stupid that question is. At 40+ years old he practiced for hours and hours every day for years without any of the common repetitive injuries. Then they ban PED's and he has elbow tendon problems. Coincidence? I doubt it. Do you think Tiger could have recovered between rounds/practice with his knee as bad as it was without PED's? Doubt it.

You're thinking of steroids like every other meat head out there. Steroids/PED's allow you to recover faster. That means practicing longer with faster recovery. It's the main reason pitchers took PED's. It wasn't to improve their strength but to speed up their recovery which in turns increases your hand & eye coordination.

Beta blockers are also banned from Golf.

Horseballs wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

Dumbell rows don't really do too much. I know this as fact, plus in order to get any benefit to dumbell rows, you need very heavy weights. Heavier than you'd need for a home gym.
Pull ups are the best lat exercise, and if you are having problems with your rotator cuff, you aren't doing them correctly. You should control the movement throughout and not bounce at the bottom. Plus, you should perform a scapular retraction prior to pulling up, which reduces any shoulder tension.

You beat me to it and I agree on both statements. Improper scapular retraction, or packing the shoulder, is the primary fault of must people who injure their shoulders doing pull ups or chin ups. Actually, not packing your shoulder is a common fault for many pushing and pulling exercises.

If I wanted to protect my shoulders by eliminating weight lifting exercises, I would scratch the overhead press and the incline bench press. Both put the should in weak positions. Other pushing exercises also hit the shoulders. Basically all of the pushing and pulling upper body exercises us the shoulders.

FD, if you have weak rotatory cuffs you should consider doing Y's, T's, W's, L's, and a bunch of bear crawls.

Edit: I just took a better look at the photo. I don't think his final position is very good. I wouldn't take my elbow past 90* or past my side. Anything past either of these two are just working your biceps which isn't the point of the row.

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

Just to clarify, do you really think dumbbell rows is one of the best exercises? Or are you just trolling? If you really think it is, could you enlighten us on your top 5 best weight/body weight exercises?

Poe4soul wrote:

Horseballs wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

Dumbell rows don't really do too much. I know this as fact, plus in order to get any benefit to dumbell rows, you need very heavy weights. Heavier than you'd need for a home gym.
Pull ups are the best lat exercise, and if you are having problems with your rotator cuff, you aren't doing them correctly. You should control the movement throughout and not bounce at the bottom. Plus, you should perform a scapular retraction prior to pulling up, which reduces any shoulder tension.

You beat me to it and I agree on both statements. Improper scapular retraction, or packing the shoulder, is the primary fault of must people who injure their shoulders doing pull ups or chin ups. Actually, not packing your shoulder is a common fault for many pushing and pulling exercises.

If I wanted to protect my shoulders by eliminating weight lifting exercises, I would scratch the overhead press and the incline bench press. Both put the should in weak positions. Other pushing exercises also hit the shoulders. Basically all of the pushing and pulling upper body exercises us the shoulders.

FD, if you have weak rotatory cuffs you should consider doing Y's, T's, W's, L's, and a bunch of bear crawls.

Edit: I just took a better look at the photo. I don't think his final position is very good. I wouldn't take my elbow past 90* or past my side. Anything past either of these two are just working your biceps which isn't the point of the row.

The rotator cuff injury occured when I was throwing my daughter up in the air in the swimming pool. I didn't even feel it when it happened. Ever since then, using a barbell for bench press or incline press really hurts. I can't even think about doing military press behind the head with a bar. Also, I have an old football injury that occurred all the way back when I was a freshman in high school and we played the JV team. The RB juked me, so I stretched out my arm to try and stop him. I heard this ripping noise from the inner part of my shoulder. I can feel it whenever I outstretch my arm to grab something, even today.

However, I have noticed that the pain is barely perceptable when I use dumbbells for bench, incline and military. The reason for this is because the dumbbells allow me to turn my hands in a little bit and it completely takes away the discomfort.

As for pullups, you guys might be right about it being a great back exercise but for me it's not a possibility. Surgery is out of the question, as I have consulted with several doctors on the subject, who play golf.

For my lats, I used the cable pulley and bring it down to my chest and then I used the machine where you sit and then grab two handle bars and bring them directly to your chest. I then do the one we've been discussing.

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

Horseballs wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Poe4soul wrote:

FamousDavis wrote:

Kiwigolfer wrote:I bought a Mountain Bike last October (about the same time we all joined the MTBR forum) and have been riding that pretty frequently over the summer and it has been great cardio exercise. Not as effective as running of course but much more fun and throwing the bike around the trails makes it more of a total body workout than road cycling. Rather than rejoining the gym for the umpteenth time and never going I have just set up a home gym. I already owned a decent set of weights so I just bought a bench. I can pretty much do all the upper body exercises I want apart from the cable rowing exercises FD mentioned. I substitute barbell rowing and one arm dumbbell rows. I also have a boxing gym setup for additional cardio/cross workout but that will not see much use until winter. The weather is so great right now I would rather get out in the fresh air and sunshine biking or golfing.

Feels great to have knocked off about 4kgs since my Xmas over indulgence.

One of the best 'rowing' exercises you can do is with a dumbbell. Place your knee and same-sided hand on the bench so that your upper body is parallel with the bench. With the other arm you bring the dumbell up toward your chest but extend your elbow up past it. It's a great exercise for your lats. [img][/img]

You mean the one arm dumbbell row he mentioned?

Sorry, a bent over barbell row and pull ups are better than a dumbbell row.

I see you are out on the prowl again, looking for mistakes where you think you can find them. Very much like A Baker.

BTW, pull ups are horrible for your shoulders once you're past the age of 40. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be doing pull ups. Especially overhand pull ups. If you want to tear your rotator cuff, go right ahead.

And, you are wrong again in regard to a barbell row vs. dumbbell row. The dumbbell row allows for greater extension and contraction of the muscle. It's also safer with less risk of injury to your back.

Trust me, I've been lifting weights for a long time and know what is proper.

Dumbell rows don't really do too much. I know this as fact, plus in order to get any benefit to dumbell rows, you need very heavy weights. Heavier than you'd need for a home gym.
Pull ups are the best lat exercise, and if you are having problems with your rotator cuff, you aren't doing them correctly. You should control the movement throughout and not bounce at the bottom. Plus, you should perform a scapular retraction prior to pulling up, which reduces any shoulder tension.

You beat me to it and I agree on both statements. Improper scapular retraction, or packing the shoulder, is the primary fault of must people who injure their shoulders doing pull ups or chin ups. Actually, not packing your shoulder is a common fault for many pushing and pulling exercises.

If I wanted to protect my shoulders by eliminating weight lifting exercises, I would scratch the overhead press and the incline bench press. Both put the should in weak positions. Other pushing exercises also hit the shoulders. Basically all of the pushing and pulling upper body exercises us the shoulders.

FD, if you have weak rotatory cuffs you should consider doing Y's, T's, W's, L's, and a bunch of bear crawls.

Edit: I just took a better look at the photo. I don't think his final position is very good. I wouldn't take my elbow past 90* or past my side. Anything past either of these two are just working your biceps which isn't the point of the row.

The rotator cuff injury occured when I was throwing my daughter up in the air in the swimming pool. I didn't even feel it when it happened. Ever since then, using a barbell for bench press or incline press really hurts. I can't even think about doing military press behind the head with a bar. Also, I have an old football injury that occurred all the way back when I was a freshman in high school and we played the JV team. The RB juked me, so I stretched out my arm to try and stop him. I heard this ripping noise from the inner part of my shoulder. I can feel it whenever I outstretch my arm to grab something, even today.

However, I have noticed that the pain is barely perceptable when I use dumbbells for bench, incline and military. The reason for this is because the dumbbells allow me to turn my hands in a little bit and it completely takes away the discomfort.

As for pullups, you guys might be right about it being a great back exercise but for me it's not a possibility. Surgery is out of the question, as I have consulted with several doctors on the subject, who play golf.

For my lats, I used the cable pulley and bring it down to my chest and then I used the machine where you sit and then grab two handle bars and bring them directly to your chest. I then do the one we've been discussing.

That sucks about your shoulder. look up the y's, t's and L's. I'd also look at some stretches for the shoulder.

Shoulders and hips are tough to rehab.

This discussion is all well and good but in my mid forties I'm simply not strong enough to do full body weight chin ups anymore. In my twenties I could crank out three sets of 12 no worries but now I'd probably be finished after one set of 3-4. That's where I miss having the cable pulldowns you get in a gym. I suppose I could get a chinup bar and put a chair or something under it and effectively 'spot' myself with that?

Kiwigolfer wrote:This discussion is all well and good but in my mid forties I'm simply not strong enough to do full body weight chin ups anymore. In my twenties I could crank out three sets of 12 no worries but now I'd probably be finished after one set of 3-4. That's where I miss having the cable pulldowns you get in a gym. I suppose I could get a chinup bar and put a chair or something under it and effectively 'spot' myself with that?

Many people use bands to aid in pull ups Link or you can do eccentric or negative reps.

Here's a link to Gold Medal Bodies (GMB) that you might like...
http://www.goldmedalbodies.com/do-more-pullups/

GMB is an exercise club that is started by the dude in the video. He's in his 40's and used to be a gymnast. He usually has good descriptions and safe progressions.

Poe4soul wrote:
Many people use bands to aid in pull ups Link or you can do eccentric or negative reps.

Here's a link to Gold Medal Bodies (GMB) that you might like...
http://www.goldmedalbodies.com/do-more-pullups/

GMB is an exercise club that is started by the dude in the video. He's in his 40's and used to be a gymnast. He usually has good descriptions and safe progressions.

Thanks Poe.

A great source of info as usual. You have mentioned kettlebells in the past. Might look into those for a bit of added variety in my workouts. It's summer now and I'm getting outdoors a lot but come winter I'll be doing more indoor workouts and variety and change helps keep me interested.

Poe4soul wrote:

Fluffy wrote:I have just learned that steroids make you hit consistent and improves your accuracy by 300%.....


Yeah right.....WTF does steroids contribute to a sport where hand & eye coordination is everything and the only thing?

Once you've watched VJ practice you'll realize how stupid that question is. At 40+ years old he practiced for hours and hours every day for years without any of the common repetitive injuries. Then they ban PED's and he has elbow tendon problems. Coincidence? I doubt it. Do you think Tiger could have recovered between rounds/practice with his knee as bad as it was without PED's? Doubt it.

You're thinking of steroids like every other meat head out there. Steroids/PED's allow you to recover faster. That means practicing longer with faster recovery. It's the main reason pitchers took PED's. It wasn't to improve their strength but to speed up their recovery which in turns increases your hand & eye coordination.

Beta blockers are also banned from Golf.

But my point being HGH is one of the more weaker steroids for this reason. The main thing HGH used for is for getting bigger. Ive read that using HGH you can literally grow 5% taller...even your heart,lungs,kidneys get bigger and stronger....Very little focused on muscular/performance enhancements. There's alot of stuff on the market that you can use legally to enhance recovery that would be more then enough for golf recovery. Where steroids get very negative reactions are within the joints....I dont think there is any steroids that help with joints...Most of them "dry" up the joints....